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Another muddle.......

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1 Another muddle....... on Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:08 pm

Hester Rosewell born 1831 Northwick Gloucestershire, parents Mark and Lydia Rosewell.

In 1855 Hester marries James Thomas born 1828 Pilning, he appears to have died in 1863. They have 2 children Clara and Henry.
In 1865 Hester remarries to a Thomas Thomas. Can find nothing about him and could well be a brother to James.

Name: Hester Thomas
[Hester Rosewell]
Gender: Female
Marital Status: Widowed
Marriage Date: 4 Oct 1865
Marriage Place: Pilning, St Peter, Gloucestershire, England
Father: Mark Rosewell
Spouse: Thomas Thomas
FHL Film Number: 4277982
------------------------------------------------Name: Hester Rosewell
Gender: Female
Marital Status: Single
Marriage Date: 16 Dec 1855
Marriage Place: Clifton, St Andrew, Gloucestershire, England
Father: Mark Rosewell
Spouse: James Thomas
FHL Film Number: 4189183

Any help would be appreciated

siamese

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2 Re: Another muddle....... on Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:25 am

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Could this be them in 1871 with 2 children all born Almondsbury Question

Thomas Thomas 59
Hester 40
William 8
Clara 8

Wrong children though unless Thomas was widowed too and they were his Neutral

3 Re: Another muddle....... on Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:32 am

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Oh dear this is a pickle

1881

Thos Thomas 69
Hester 49
Harry 8
Thos 5

The boys are down as children.

1891

Thomas 79
Hester 59
Henry 18

Better go back to 1861 and trace the right 2 children first - when were Clara and Henry born?

4 Re: Another muddle....... on Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:41 am

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1861 for Thomas with a Hester Rosewell - could she be related to your Hester?

Thomas Thomas 49 Head married
Hester Rosewell 67 Sister Widow
George Thomas 69 Brother married
George Thomas 34 Nephew married
Ann Creed 47 Sister Widow

Previous census page same add Cross Hands Almondsbury are

James Thomas 33
Hester 29
Clara 5
Henry 2

In 1871 Clara 15 is with her Rosewell grandparents.

5 Re: Another muddle....... on Mon Sep 07, 2015 12:39 pm

"1861 for Thomas with a Hester Rosewell - could she be related to your Hester?

Thomas Thomas 49 Head married
Hester Rosewell 67 Sister Widow
George Thomas 69 Brother married
George Thomas 34 Nephew married
Ann Creed 47 Sister Widow

Previous census page same add Cross Hands Almondsbury are

James Thomas 33
Hester 29
Clara 5
Henry 2

In 1871 Clara 15 is with her Rosewell grandparents."

This is the correct family, do not know what happened to Henry. James and Hester marry in 1855 and Thomas and Thomasin 1865. What is confusing there is another Hester and Thomas Thomas but born in Bristol also children are older.

siamese

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6 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 8:44 am

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It is confusing, I thought the Thomas that married Hester was single so, in theory, he shouldn't be married in 1861 (IF that is him and if so where was his wife?)

Does Thomasin appear anywhere or has she died before census?

7 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:12 am

Sorry no Thomasin, meant to be Thomas in

siamese

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8 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:14 am

Wander if Thomas was a widower in 1865 when he married Hester, she certainly was a widow

siamese

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9 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:17 am

No he is down as single

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10 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:26 am

Looks like both Clara and Henry were living with their grandparents in 1871. Found this entry but whether its the same Henry
Name: Henry Rosewell
Residence Date: 2 Apr 1887
Station: Bristol
Company: Great Western
Description: No.5 1860-1883 Bristol Division

There are dozens of marriages on FreeBMD for Clara Thomas Bristol.

Another brick wall????????
siamese

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11 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:55 am

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"Looks like both Clara and Henry were living with their grandparents in 1871"

Just Clara. The Henry is a different Henry not Henry Thomas who would have been about 12.

Mark Rosewell 67
Lydia Rosewell 62
Henry Rosewell 22 son
Clara Thomas 15 granddaughter

Perhaps the "married" for Thomas in 1861 was a mistake on the census.
He doesn't have a wife with him.

12 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 10:32 am

Yes you are right, Henry age 22 is the son of Lydia and Mark

siamese

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13 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 11:58 am

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Maybe the first Henry died as they seem to have a Harry/Henry later on born about 1873.

It is tricky with Thomas Thomas though.

Do we have fathers names from the 2 marriages to Hester to see if he and James had the same one?



14 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 12:13 pm

Name James Thomas
Spouse's Name Hester Rosewell
Event Date 16 Dec 1855
Event Place St. Andrews, Clifton, Gloucester, England
Father's Name James Thomas
Spouse's Father's Name Mark Rosewell

----------------------------------------------
Hester (Widow) Thomas
mentioned in the record of Thomas Thomas and Hester (Widow) Thomas
Name Thomas Thomas
Birth Date 1815
Age 50
Spouse's Name Hester (Widow) Thomas
Spouse's Birth Date 1832
Spouse's Age 33
Event Date 04 Oct 1865
Event Place St Peter'S, Almondsbury, Gloucester, England
Father's Name William Thomas
Spouse's Father's Name Mark Rosewell
------------------------------------------------
Found on familysearch, 2 different fathers

Have to go out so will resume later

siamese

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15 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 3:57 pm

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Don't know if this will help but in 1911 Hester is widowed and puts married 54 years 7 children 5 still living.

Now whether she is counting back to the first marriage or from when she was widowed and adding all her children together is hard to say.

Any baptisms about?



16 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:02 pm

7 children so far only 2 have been discovered. More research
siamese

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17 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:08 pm

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It doesn't add up does it.

We have Clara and Henry from marriage one in 1861.

William and Kate both 8 in 1871 so born before the marriage to Thomas. Looking at it I think Kate is 3 not 8 but William is still a problem unless he was 5? But it looks like an 8 so maybe he belonged to marriage one.

Then we have Harry 8 and Thos 5 in 1881 then only Harry appears with his mother so at best we have 6 children.

18 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:15 pm

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Name:
Kate Thomas

Gender:
Female

Baptism Date:
11 Aug 1867

Baptism Place:
St Peter's, Almondsbury, Gloucester, England

Father:
Thomas Thomas

Mother:
Esther

So she was 3 not 8 that's good.

19 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:17 pm

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Name:
Thomas Thomas

Gender:
Male

Baptism Date:
29 Aug 1875

Baptism Place:
St. Peter's, Almondsbury, Gloucester, England

Father:
Thomas Thomas

Mother:
Hester

20 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:18 pm

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Name:
Harry Thomas

Gender:
Male

Baptism Date:
1 Sep 1872

Baptism Place:
St. Peter's, Almondsbury, Gloucester, England

Father:
Thomas Thomas

Mother:
Hester

21 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:21 pm

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She liked the name Henry didn't she, this could be the William age 8 in 1871 so he did belong to marriage one.

Name:
William Henry Thomas

Gender:
Male

Baptism Date:
3 May 1863

Baptism Place:
Almondsbury, Gloucester, England

Father:
James Thomas

Mother:
Hester

22 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:23 pm

Found on familysearch

Descendants of :
Hester Rosewell

Generation 1

1. Hester Rosewell was born 1831 in Northwick Gloucestershire and died 1915 in Thornbury. She married James Thomas 16 Dec 1855 in Clifton Bristol. He was born 1828 in Almondsbury Gloucestershire and died 1863 in Thornbury. She married Thomas Thomas 04 Oct 1865 in Pilning.

Other events in the life of Hester Rosewell
Baptism: 22 Apr 1833 in Northwick

Children of Hester Rosewell and James Thomas:
i. Clara Thomas was born 1856 in Almondsbury Gloucestershire
ii. Henry Thomas was born 1859 in Almondsbury Gloucestershire
iii. William Thomas was born 1861 in Almondsbury Gloucestershire
iv. William Henry Thomas was born 1863 in Almondsbury Gloucestershire

Children of Hester Rosewell and Thomas Thomas:
v. Kate Thomas was born 1867 in Almondsbury Gloucestershire
vi. Harry Thomas was born 1872 in Almondsbury Gloucestershire
vii. Thomas Thomas was born 1875 in Almondsbury Gloucestershire

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23 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:23 pm

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Maybe this little one died and the next one was called William too

Name:
William James Thomas

Gender:
Male

Baptism Date:
9 Jun 1861

Baptism Place:
St. Peter's, Almondsbury, Gloucester, England

Father:
James Thomas

Mother:
Hester

24 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:26 pm

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Oh well done siamese so those are the 7 children - we were getting there! cheers

25 Re: Another muddle....... on Tue Sep 08, 2015 4:30 pm

Looks like both Henry b 1859 and William b 1861 died.

siamese

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