Address search 1881 please

67 Pratt Street Camden Town London.

I'm hoping it will be Edward Neaves 48 and wife Grace 34 who married in 1880.  Or a variation thereof as I can't find them searching by those names. Edwards occupation was painter.

Address comes from baptism of daughter 5 March 1882.  

Can you give name of daughter please. Searched the 1881 census on familysearch no joy regarding Edward and Grace but maybe on the 1891 census using the daughter's name may find something.

siamese

Thanks siamese.

Daughter was Mary Lottie Letitia born 30/10/1881. Married as Etty.
There was another daughter but she was born and died between census.

It gets complicated as Grace has died by 1891 and Edward remarried in 1885 to Caroline.
I can't find them in 1891 either. Edward dies in 1894.

My knowledge of London geography is more than a bit rubbish, so I am not likely to be much help [aiming for masterly understatement here]

On FMP it's possible to search by address, so I put Pratt Street in the street bit and Campden Town in the Residential Place bit.  0 results.  Then just tried Pratt Street and there are 4 in the country, but 2 in London: 1 in Lambeth and 1 in St Pancras.  Trouble is, there's no house number 67 on either of 'em.

Don't know why but the 1881 seems free to search on FMP - for a transcription (not to view the image), which I think means that the Mormons have transcribed it too.  Orf to see if I can find them there.

Where was Edward born, please?

I've found this.  Any use?

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1795/40020_214526-00813/132268600?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3frank%3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d1%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-c%26gsfn%3dedward%26gsln%3dneaves%26msbdy%3d1833%26msrpn__ftp%3dCamden%2bTown%252c%2bMiddlesex%252c%2bEngland%26msrpn%3d1671071%26msrpn_PInfo%3d8-%257c0%257c0%257c3257%257c3251%257c0%257c0%257c0%257c5275%257c1671071%257c0%257c%26gskw%3dpainter%26cpxt%3d1%26uidh%3dykz%26msbdp%3d1%26cp%3d11%26mssng0%3dgrace%26pcat%3dCEN_1880%26h%3d132268600%26recoff%3d6%2b7%26db%3dLMAelectoralreg%26indiv%3d1%26hovR%3d1&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord

OK. I'm back. Using one of the names from the sheet I found on FMP for Pratt Street, St Pancras, which I now know is where Camden Town is, I've found the same family on Ancestry, living at 83 Pratt St. Then I worked backwards for a few pages trying to get to No. 67, only to find that Pratt Street seems to start at No. 73. Arghh! Will keep trying.

I can't find a baptism for the other little girl to see where they were living but that was 1883.  

Just thought I could check what address they were living in 1880 when they married......hang on*

*81 Hampstead Road - any luck with that one in 1881 please

Tried FMP for Hampstead Road, St Pancras.  Numbers jump from 63 Sols Arms (pub, presumably) to 173.

Not having much luck here, are we?

Here's a page on from the pub, which seems to cover No. 81 ...



http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/7572/LNDRG11_174_179-0934/13896058?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3frank%3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d1%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-c%26gsfn%3dbenjamin%26gsln%3dbeach%26msbdy%3d1840%26msbpn__ftp%3dMiddlesex%252c%2bEngland%26msbpn%3d5275%26msbpn_PInfo%3d7-%257c0%257c0%257c3257%257c3251%257c0%257c0%257c0%257c5275%257c0%257c0%257c%26msrpn__ftp%3dCamden%2bTown%252c%2bMiddlesex%252c%2bEngland%26msrpn%3d1671071%26msrpn_PInfo%3d8-%257c0%257c0%257c3257%257c3251%257c0%257c0%257c0%257c5275%257c1671071%257c0%257c%26uidh%3dykz%26mssng0%3dlouisa%26pcat%3d1881UKI%26h%3d13896058%26db%3duki1881%26indiv%3d1%26ml_rpos%3d1&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord#?imageId=LNDRG11_174_179-0935

Frustrating isn't it but thanks for looking. Need that 1881 to find out if Grace is who we want her to be which means finding her birthplace (Bristol/Clifton 1845) on a census.

However if we could find her in 1871 or her previous marriage to a Mr Lester that might help.
When she marries Edward in 1880 her surname is Lester but she is widowed.
Father Joseph Edwards and Grace Edwards is who we want her to be.

I can't find a Lester/Grace marriage nor can I be sure when she married him. There may have been a husband before that I don't know so what surname she is under in 1871 is kind of a grey area  

Told you it was complicated  

3rd time lucky found an address for Edward 1894 - 12 Carlow St Camden - any sign of this address in 1891 pretty please?

Still can't find Grace or her previous marriage.  Humph

Found an Edward Cheese in 1891 well it's a sound-a-like for Neaves if nothing else  

There's a Coe family at 12 Carlow St in 1891.

Where was Edward born, pls? Would that help in the search?

He was 48 when he married Grace in 1880 so birth year about 1832. This was my first knowledge of him and census entries are few and far between.

His father was George deceased and Edward was a painter.

There's an Edward born Kew Surrey 1834 with a father George in 1861.
Age 27 single and a gardener. Appropriate enough for Kew  

Maybe finding his previous marriage/wife would help. If he was single 1861 he must have married and she died between then and 1880.

There's a baptism on Ancestry for an Edward, with a father George and mother Letitia Louisa - so that's where he got his daughter's name from.

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1558/31280_198978-00066/4899028?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3frank%3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d1%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-g%26gsfn%3dedward%26gsln%3dneaves%26msbdy%3d1832%26msbpn__ftp%3dLondon%252c%2bLondon%252c%2bEngland%26msbpn%3d85535%26msbpn_PInfo%3d8-%257c0%257c0%257c3257%257c3251%257c0%257c0%257c0%257c5274%257c85535%257c0%257c%26msfng0%3dgeorge%26cpxt%3d1%26catBucket%3drstp%26uidh%3dykz%26cp%3d11%26pcat%3dROOT_CATEGORY%26h%3d4899028%26recoff%3d9%2b10%2b36%2b47%2b48%26db%3dLMAbirths%26indiv%3d1%26ml_rpos%3d2&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord


Could this be Edward's first marriage ?

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1623/31280_198449-00169/3748403?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3frank%3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d1%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-g%26gsfn%3dedward%26gsln%3dneaves%26msbdy%3d1832%26msbpn__ftp%3dLondon%252c%2bLondon%252c%2bEngland%26msbpn%3d85535%26msbpn_PInfo%3d8-%257c0%257c0%257c3257%257c3251%257c0%257c0%257c0%257c5274%257c85535%257c0%257c%26msfng0%3dgeorge%26cpxt%3d1%26catBucket%3drstp%26uidh%3dykz%26cp%3d11%26pcat%3dROOT_CATEGORY%26h%3d3748403%26recoff%3d8%2b9%2b27%2b28%26db%3dLMAmarriages%26indiv%3d1%26ml_rpos%3d16&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord

and this his second ?

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1623/31280_198436-00538/3736031?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3frank%3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d1%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-g%26gsfn%3dedward%26gsln%3dneaves%26msbdy%3d1832%26msbpn__ftp%3dLondon%252c%2bLondon%252c%2bEngland%26msbpn%3d85535%26msbpn_PInfo%3d8-%257c0%257c0%257c3257%257c3251%257c0%257c0%257c0%257c5274%257c85535%257c0%257c%26msfng0%3dgeorge%26cpxt%3d1%26catBucket%3drstp%26uidh%3dykz%26cp%3d11%26pcat%3dROOT_CATEGORY%26h%3d3736031%26recoff%3d8%2b9%2b27%2b28%26db%3dLMAmarriages%26indiv%3d1%26ml_rpos%3d17&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord

which would make Grace Wife No. 3 and Caroline Wife No. 4!

Cheers for that it all seems to fit  

He may have left it till his 30's for marriage number one but he sure made up for lost time after that.

Can you see a marriage for Grace to a Mr Lester please? I just can't see one. If it was her first marriage it should be under Grace Edwards. If she was a serial spouse like Edward could be under anything!

Drawn a bit of a blank with a previous marriage for Grace.  According to FreeBMD there are only two marriages for someone SN Lester to someone GN Grace.  One in Keighley 1864, the other in York in 1865, neither of which seem particularly likely.

Someone on Ancestry seems to have her on their Edwards Tree, baptised 20 Jul 1845 in Abbots Leigh, Somerset, d/o Joseph Edwards (1807-1847) and Grace Hill (1807-2883)

and this seems to be her with Mum and siblings (but no dad) in 1851

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/8860/GLSHO107_1952_1952-0906/17212301?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3frank%3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d1%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-g%26gsfn%3dgrace%26gsln%3dedwards%26msbdy%3d1846%26msbpn__ftp%3dBristol%252c%2bGloucestershire%252c%2bEngland%26msbpn%3d202043%26msbpn_PInfo%3d8-%257c0%257c0%257c3257%257c3251%257c0%257c0%257c0%257c5265%257c202043%257c0%257c%26msfng0%3djoseph%26cpxt%3d1%26catBucket%3drstp%26uidh%3dykz%26cp%3d11%26pcat%3dROOT_CATEGORY%26h%3d17212301%26recoff%3d6%2b7%26db%3duki1851%26indiv%3d1%26ml_rpos%3d2&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord

All a bit of a puzzle really.

Me again! This is Grace in 1861. The user-submitted note is interesting.

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?rank=1&new=1&MSAV=1&msT=1&gss=angs-c&gsfn=grace&gsln=edwards&msbdy=1846&msbpn__ftp=Bristol%2c+Gloucestershire%2c+England&msbpn=202043&msbpn_PInfo=8-%7c0%7c0%7c3257%7c3251%7c0%7c0%7c0%7c5265%7c202043%7c0%7c&msfng0=joseph&cpxt=1&catBucket=rstp&uidh=ykz&cp=11&pcat=CEN_1860&h=18070985&db=uki1861&indiv=1&ml_rpos=3

Yes that's the Grace Edwards we are looking to find. Her mother was Grace Hill then Grace Edwards then Grace Parslow.

Young Grace disappears after 1861 then I found that marriage to Edward with the correct fathers name and am trying to prove tis her and not some other Grace father Joseph.

Without that 1881 census entry to see her birthplace and/or her previous marriage as evidence it's proving rather tricky.

Just noticed that the witnesses on the Edward/Grace marriage are the same witnesses for another marriage on the same page. Significant or were they serial witnesses  

Her name is Eliza Drake but not sure about his. Drake but first name Roland or Robert? *

The other marriage is Elizabeth Weir Maclean and William Mutch 8 Dec 1880.

*Found a Robert & Eliza Drake in 1881. He is a school keeper so I guess of suitable credentials to be a witness.

None of this helps any but hey.